NG: DEV.Team: Razion

[Chempop]

the ship moves faster diagonally than in the four main directions.

So does Garegga

[emphatic]

the ship moves faster diagonally than in the four main directions.

So does Garegga

While this is true, it's one small flaw in an otherwise spectacularly crafted game. NG:DEV won't improve on their own standards, if they do I'd be very surprised, as their games will be sold out to the collectors in any case. They've found a golden goose, laying golden eggs with a yolk of ****.

[pubjoe]

but can't cut the mustard with a game that would cost, what, $5

Well that's the state of the market today. $0 to $5 with as broad as possible appeal. Reach for millions or die. We all moan about the current generation and here's a company rebelling. You're either interested or your not, but I can't understand the hate.

What are they going to charge anyway? $50 a cart? Yeah... don't do it for the money at all (and spend ten years never-finishing a game in their leisure time).

They've tried to balance the price at a point that makes the whole venture feasible. It seems to be working (although only-just I'd imagine). Fair play to them. And like with all this sort of stuff, you're getting a physical item that retains value, not a worthless download code. Ok, it doesn't make it a bargain, but it's a factor.

Also it's a bit unfair to compare them to companies with so many games more experience ...and who charged a lot more per game.

[theMot]

I'm still waiting for someone on n-g forum to clear NeoXYX.

I'm almost there Chem...slowly slowly mate.

[Chempop]

the ship moves faster diagonally than in the four main directions.

So does Garegga

While this is true, it's one small flaw in an otherwise spectacularly crafted game. NG:DEV won't improve on their own standards, if they do I'd be very surprised, as their games will be sold out to the collectors in any case. They've found a golden goose, laying golden eggs with a yolk of ****.

The latest patch on NeoXYX apparently lets you choose between normalized movement and the weird fast diagonals. I heard it was the main criticism from the japanese arcade testing.

[Tarma]

but can't cut the mustard with a game that would cost, what, $5

Well that's the state of the market today. $0 to $5 with as broad as possible appeal. Reach for millions or die. We all moan about the current generation and here's a company rebelling. You're either interested or your not, but I can't understand the hate.

What are they going to charge anyway? $50 a cart? Yeah... don't do it for the money at all (and spend ten years never-finishing a game in their leisure time).

They've tried to balance the price at a point that makes the whole venture feasible. It seems to be working (although only-just I'd imagine). Fair play to them. And like with all this sort of stuff, you're getting a physical item that retains value, not a worthless download code. Ok, it doesn't make it a bargain, but it's a factor.

Also it's a bit unfair to compare them to companies with so many games more experience ...and who charged a lot more per game.

Hate is a strong word... I don't "hate" them or their games... I certainly do not like any of their titles, for varying reasons, but I am suspicious of their business model.

Last Hope came out in, what, 2006? I think they've had plenty of time to hone their craft... but they don't need to when they can recycle another developers idea and toss in sprites from their own library and charge $600 with people lining up down the street with their cash.

I would have thought if they ever wanted to be taken seriously they'd try and get something out on download at least... if you're doing something you love you want to do it as often as possible. For game dev that takes money as we all know - so why not try for the stars?

[crunchywasp]

Because they don't have to try that hard. The majority of rabid Neo-Geo fans and their money are easily parted and will lap up anything that's thrown at them - the product doesn't have to be good - folks lining up to buy the 161 in 1 AES cart for $700 being the most recent example.

NG:DEV must be making money and they know fine well that they can shift whatever they produce be it a rehash or otherwise. Surely it's naive to think that they'd keep releasing games if the only reward was kudos? Do they feel that they owe any loyalty to the small communities that buy their games? They probably should but I doubt they do.

Meh, I'm a bit cynical is all. I've bought my fair share of rubbish yet expensive games but none just for the sake of ownership. At least none in recent memory

[pubjoe]

Love--Money. Realistically, everything ever created and sold has come from a point somewhere in the middle of those two extremities. Nothing's entirely one or the other and we could have a never-ending debate about where exactly on the scale any product sits.

The 161-in-1 AES hash. That's clearly an empty money venture. NGDev is nothing like that.

NGDev. For one I think an awful lot of effort goes into their graphics work. I certainly wouldn't say they're just slapping it together. Don't like it, fine, but that doesn't mean they're beginning work each day to continue scamming their latest game up.

They're piling on presentation but who can blame them. Let's face it, this business model is already going to be expensive no matter what. If you go to an expensive restaurant you don't expect the chef to slap a dollop of food in front of you.

Tarma, I quoted your comment about $5 games to make a point about today's broad market. Hate is a strong word but let's just say there's a lot of strong dislike.

I don't quite understand what you're getting at with your last paragraph. Yes it takes money, or more to the point, time. They're a small team and it seems to me they're already spending their time making games they want to play. I guess you and me disagree on how long this takes them. By the way, I'm sure many highly regarded classic arcade games were knocked out in much quicker time.

Releasing a cheap download would kill it, for the same reason as it would kill Mariokart 8 if Nintendo released a $5 smartphone version. No one would experience the game how it's intended.

[pubjoe]

Looking on ebay the other day I discovered that I could swap my Wonderboy PCB for £200 if I wanted.

A blatant 'me too' game from Sega, with little graphical variety and repetitive gameplay that drags on and on. It took Escape a few months to make. They were on a deadline because Sega wanted to hurry it out and make money at an obscene price per board.

I love the game. I'm keeping it.

DisplayCollapse view

...probably

[crunchywasp]

lots of sensible stuff

Alright pj, take a deep breath

Like most things I agree with you in the main. I was mostly getting at the NG community rather than NGDev themselves really. The point I was trying to make is they'll buy whatever's put in front of them regardless of quality and cost. I don't really know much about NGDev and have never played their games so my opinion's based on what little I have read and entirely without authority - maybe they do truly put their heart, soul and a bit of love in to their games and make them as good as they're capable of making them, although when selling to Neo-Geo fans that's not entirely necessary as they'll just buy whatever anyway. I'm just skeptical that they care about the folks paying $600 per piece for their output.

I'm sure developing and producing their games in cart format is pricey but there still must be an element of knowing the market, what folks are willing to pay and so inflating the costs accordingly? Like any other business they deserve to be rewarded for their efforts so fair play, but I'm skeptical about their motivation being loyalty to their fans and those of Neo-Geo.

[theMot]

People say that about the NG Community wasp but it isnt true. I will agree with you that there are maybe a dozen guys like that tops who just buy anything because they must have it it or risk missing out but the rest of us are just fans of the games. Besides, those hardcore types are almost all into home carts not MVS.

[pubjoe]

Deep breath Ahhhh....

And here I go again.

They do deserve reward. Before they knew the market they guessed the market. This was a huge gamble. If someone started a thread saying "Grandma's made an arcade game, should I produce it on real hardware and sell it?", We all would have said it would be hopeless.

Considering the gamble they made and the potential success (that they've now achieved), I reckon the risk/reward still wouldn't be financially justified even with hindsight. I think it took a fair amount of love to take the chance in the first place. Big balled love.

---

Now, please allow me to take **** ages to make a point regarding criticism with the game ( ):

I obviously haven't played it so I can't comment on gameplay. We have the look and style to go on and it's receiving criticism there. This game's look, like all their others is openly heavily-inspired from previous games.

Originality is an illusion. All there really is are trends, distorted by progressive technology. You can follow the 'safe' modern trend and appear unoriginal, or follow an old trend (incorporated into modern fashion) and have something that looks ingeniously original if you pull if off.

When in a matured industry (or art form), inspiration eventually becomes impossible to hide. Just look at music.

Saying you want an original shmup is like saying you want an original boy band. The word 'shmup' is already synonymous with games that defined the genre ...enemy waves, big bosses, power-ups, organic robots, etc... just as the word 'boy-band' is synonymous with repeated vocalised orgasms.

I kind of respect the ripoff philosophy of 'why hide it?'.

In this game we have an immediate r-type reference. clusters of fluttering red ships. Copied by later games and itself copied from previous games. In fact it's become a shmup tradition followed by pretty much every game.

They could have changed them to blue ships, or mecha-frogs, or wasps, but it's all been done before anyway.

I like what they've done. It's a design choice. And it's honest. It immediately says 'lets just get this out of the way, we're going to rip off other games.'

[Tarma]

lots of sensible stuff

Like most things I agree with you in the main. I was mostly getting at the NG community rather than NGDev themselves really. The point I was trying to make is they'll buy whatever's put in front of them regardless of quality and cost. I don't really know much about NGDev and have never played their games so my opinion's based on what little I have read and entirely without authority - maybe they do truly put their heart, soul and a bit of love in to their games and make them as good as they're capable of making them, although when selling to Neo-Geo fans that's not entirely necessary as they'll just buy whatever anyway. I'm just skeptical that they care about the folks paying $600 per piece for their output.

I'm sure developing and producing their games in cart format is pricey but there still must be an element of knowing the market, what folks are willing to pay and so inflating the costs accordingly? Like any other business they deserve to be rewarded for their efforts so fair play, but I'm skeptical about their motivation being loyalty to their fans and those of Neo-Geo.

This was pretty much the sentiment I was trying to get across regarding this.

Genuinely though, those who buy I hope enjoy it no matter what they pay for it, who knows, I may even like if I get to play it... but not for $600.

[pubjoe]

What was the price of the now sold out loose cart anyway?

[LEGENOARYNINLIA]

I find it rather devious to announce a game before E3 and say it is out in a couple of months.

[pubjoe]

Am I going bonkers? I could have sworn I saw a sold out "gamers edition" when I looked at the link a few days ago.

Anyway, my sentiment is just that I feel strongly that NG:Dev's existence is justified. Whether I even like their games is beside the point, as is the fact that I can't afford them.

[SuperPang]

Good look to em I say.

[pubjoe]

Exooctly.

[cRacKh0rN]

I'm glad companies like this still exist, but I can't say I'm a big fan of their games. They all remind me of Amiga shooters.

[crunchywasp]

I don't know what I think