skykid wrote:I can't play on anything except LV.2 rank otherwise it's too easy and not enough scoring opportunity, but I can't play level 3's or 999's because they're stupidly tough.
Rank Level 3 is fine (I play at that level), it's Death mode that is stupidly hard (after choosing 5 rank 3). I routinely play 4x rank 3 and 2x rank 2 (the two at this level are boring, but keeps from Death mode), and I'm not very good with Cave games.
I don't play it for score, particularly (I try and optimise scoring to a certain extent, but don't care too much since the scoring system is rather broken). That's probably why I still enjoy the game.
"TO THE untrained eye Christian Cooper might have been stamping out a small fire " - The Times, 7th Feb, 2004
skykid wrote:I can't play on anything except LV.2 rank otherwise it's too easy and not enough scoring opportunity, but I can't play level 3's or 999's because they're stupidly tough.
Rank Level 3 is fine (I play at that level), it's Death mode that is stupidly hard (after choosing 5 rank 3). I routinely play 4x rank 3 and 2x rank 2 (the two at this level are boring, but keeps from Death mode), and I'm not very good with Cave games.
I don't play it for score, particularly (I try and optimise scoring to a certain extent, but don't care too much since the scoring system is rather broken). That's probably why I still enjoy the game.
Sorry, my bad - I always play level 3's too, just avoid doing all the pre-stages at this to avoid the 999 rank - I can't handle that. I think I do forest stage at Rank 2 usually.
Always outnumbered, never outgunned.
SuperPang wrote:
Where DOJ rapes you, DFK grabs your boob then runs away.
I love Deathsmiles and MBL- I thought I would be good with the port of MBL after trading Chi's board away for DFK. But I'm looking to get it for a freaking 3rd time down the road.
Twonk wrote:Nobody passed this game to you claiming it was 100% real.
kernow wrote:I don't know why, I like Ketsui but playing it infuriates me, a stupid death and I'm FUUUUUuuuuuu, even more so than stupid deaths on Ibara.
Like a double rainbow, the game is so intense though it literally doesn't give you any breathing space, its just hammering **** on you and I'm like OH FFS GIVE ME FIVE SECONDS FUUUUUuuuu
sigh
This is exactly why I love this game, It's so intense and requires every bit of skill I can muster. No time to ponder your days troubles once level 4 starts. Also I agree a death on kets is heartbreaking, its very hard to get back in the groove once you've died in a tight spot.
The worst cave game I have tried is progear by far. The sound of the gem collecting makes me want to murder kittens.
markedkiller78 wrote:If you play DS for fun / scores up to 200m, it's an excellent game.
All the negatives Tom has listed about scoring are the elements that give the game some depth.
It's not hard, it is pretty and it offers novices a chance to learn the same game as experts, which was a first for cave at the time. When you play Mushi you get 3 difficulty modes, but the scoring is so different in each that the skills you learn are applicable to that mode only.
In DS you can start of easy (very easy) and slowy step up the difficulty when you feel comfortable thanks to the rank select.
It's not Caves beat game and I initially hated it, but figuring out the re-boost timings and scoring hotspots was addictive as hell. It's also forgiving (I am talking low scoring here) with re-boost as you can bomb to cut the power mode time.
I thought you were talking about me for a sec ^_- And yeah, while it gives it some depth, I just don't find it fun to begin with. Don't appreciate the depth at all.
Brief few credits on Deathsmiles tonight to make sure the boards were 100% (they are!).
First one, level-1 difficulty throughout. Die on the 2-2 boss because I'm not familiar with ship speed and get caught. Game doesn't thrill me much, exactly how it's felt before.
Subsequent ones, level-3 difficulty throughout. Die on the 1-2 boss but have a big grin all the way there. Hugely enjoyable, far more manic but completely fair with it. I have a sneaking suspicion I might end up liking it in the same way I like Futari.
There's something strangely satisfying about filling the screen with gold crowns (or Diamond rings in DS2's case). Something simple shouldn't be so much fun yet Cave always seem to make it so. And then there's the suicide bullets in death mode, super fun.
I found that I really did not like DS to begin with. It seemed a bit boring and easy, then far too hard when the suicide bullets came into play.
However, I found that I was playing every day & even though I didn’t believe I was enjoying it, I always wanted to one more play.
Anyways, I eventually clicked with it & still think it's was one of caves best (in recent years). Once you figure out the recharge points & start to score heavily on Forest, Volcano & cemetery it becomes a totally different game.
Yeah I had a quick blast this morning while eating breakfast. Dived straight into C-2 rank 3 after A-1 and spent the level hoovering up big gold crowns. Great fun.
Install it properly in the cab tonight, setup the monitor and give it a "new game" evening
Ooh and I've got Pink Sweets on its way again. I missed it.
u srs? When it even has a cool scoring system and some difficulty before the last stage? And isn't paced like a dying dog? And has cooler colors? You still think Deathsmiles is better? D:
Chi wrote:Rank Level 3 is fine (I play at that level), it's Death mode that is stupidly hard (after choosing 5 rank 3). I routinely play 4x rank 3 and 2x rank 2 (the two at this level are boring, but keeps from Death mode), and I'm not very good with Cave games.
I don't play it for score, particularly (I try and optimise scoring to a certain extent, but don't care too much since the scoring system is rather broken). That's probably why I still enjoy the game.
I'm used to Rank 3 now and Death mode is awesome fun on certain levels. My route goes C,A,A,C at rank 3, then B at rank 2, and finally B at rank 3 again if I'm doing well. Will play about with the PCB difficulty setting sometime too to see what difference it makes.
Having played Akai Katana a hell of a lot it's pretty clear to see where the idea came from for that game, and that practice has helped a lot in controlling the option to cancel bullets
Medal wrote:u srs? When it even has a cool scoring system and some difficulty before the last stage? And isn't paced like a dying dog? And has cooler colors? You still think Deathsmiles is better? D:
This debate has been broadcast over on shmups for a while now.
I don't know why, but NONE of the Hori Cave games really do it for me... Deathsmiles seems conceptually cool but doesn't really pull me in. Ironically I thought it'd be a badass game before I got to play it, then I got into Cave by way of Galuda and a few other games, and when I got to play DS it just didn't impress me. Then again, I haven't really bothered to track down Progear or spend much time on DS.
Oh, and Guwange doesn't impress me.... but then again I don't understand the scoring, so..... meh.
Of the Cave games I've spent serious time with, Fever SOS was the easiest to let go. Galuda 2 seems needlessly compex and doesn't really impress me, especially since Galuda 1 was so perfect... but the game is a beautiful temptress, so...
Lots of people mentioned Deathsmiles. The first time I played it, I hated it, but it grew on me (granted I don't own the board, my playtime has been in game centers and therefore pretty limited).
However, Deathsmiles 2 is drek. The use of 3D is terribly done, makes the game look like it was made for the atomiswave. One of the things that I liked about CAVE was that they were one of the last bastions of 2D artwork in games, if they throw that away, they are dead to me.
Also, some of the bosses are just retarded. A reindeer? Really?
Edit-
Just saw "excluding DS2" in the initial post, sorry. I transfer my vote to Espgaluda.
I don't think much of DDP DFK (or Black Label). However, the arrange mode on the Black Label port is absolutely awesome fun (it's encouraged me to finally get the pad hacks up and running so I can play it on the cab). I don't think it's the weakest title, though.
"TO THE untrained eye Christian Cooper might have been stamping out a small fire " - The Times, 7th Feb, 2004
I don't think much of DDP DFK (or Black Label). However, the arrange mode on the Black Label port is absolutely awesome fun (it's encouraged me to finally get the pad hacks up and running so I can play it on the cab). I don't think it's the weakest title, though.
My BL should arrive this week. As for DFK, Arrange A is oh so full of win. Definitely ups the game in my estimation.
Always outnumbered, never outgunned.
SuperPang wrote:
Where DOJ rapes you, DFK grabs your boob then runs away.
Neo'nate wrote:Im pretty saddened that Espgaluda and Espgaluda 2 are getting so much hate as well! They are both bloody ace!
Necrobump.
I've picked up Espgaluda II again, for the third time. The colours on my Pony monitor were reset a month or two ago and it looks stunning on screen this time, and the music isn't as terrible as I remembered (though it's still not great).
I'm actually enjoying it this time. I'm ignoring autofire and just playing with three buttons, and this seems to gel with me more than the four button method. It's also bloody hard on L1 if you try to score, so I'm hoping that the beginning levels don't get dull quickly - which is what killed the first one for me.
Fingers crossed it's a keeper. It's at least reached the price level where it's one that can sit around for months without worrying that there's a significant value attached to something unused.
Took me years to finally be arsed to figure out the Zesshikai system properly but it's bloody brilliant, if a little random at times, and I've barely scratched the surface. One of my Cave top 5 for sure and number one on the pretty list.
SuperPang wrote:ESP RaDe isn't the deepest of Cave shmups but I do really like it. It looks and feels quite different to other Cave titles. Like kern said, it seems like Cave had one eye on Raizing at the time. Smaller bullets than usual too.
The three weakest titles that spring to my mind are:
Pink Sweets: Too hard, silly wavy lasers, horrible mix of graphical styles.
Deathsmiles 2: Looks like **** and doesn't offer as much as the first in the gameplay dept either. IIX is a massive improvement though.
Feveron: Too fast. Almost impossible to keep track of the disco blokes beyond the first level. Saved by an incredible soundtrack and lovely pixel art.
Wow. Completely changed my mind. Esprade is now my least favourite Cave title, I've started to enjoy Pink Sweets and DS2 v4.0 is amazing (when it works). Still feel the same about Feveron though.
grin all the way there. Hugely enjoyable, far more manic but completely fair with it. I have a sneaking suspicion I might end up liking it in the same way I like Futari.
Wow. Completely changed my mind. Esprade is now my least favourite Cave title, I've started to enjoy Pink Sweets and DS2 v4.0 is amazing (when it works). Still feel the same about Feveron though.